Adil Najam
The two videos attached below - one of a student speaking at a student convention presided over by Gen. Pervez Musharraf and the second of an MNA speaking in the National Assembly during the no-trust motion against Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz - have recently been floating around over email on Pakistani lists.
[Thanks to Eidee Man for alerting us to this new version of the first video which includes Gen. Musharraf's Response to the student's speech. Even if you have seen the student's speech already, the response is worth listening to.]
While the remarks from Muslim League (N) MNA Khawaja Asif is less surprising (especially since it came right after Nawab Akbar Bugti’s death and during a no-confidence motion) the speech from the student (Syed Adnan Kakakhel) is much more of a surprise. Gen. Musharraf listens intently, takes notes, and seems engaged. Indeed, as you can now see from his response (later in the video) the speech certainly got to Gen. Musharraf. He responds at length - including on the military rule and Balochistan issues.
I should also add that this event was organized by the government itself and also note that Adnan Kakakhel was awarded the second prize in the speech contest and also that this was telecast over Pakistan Television.
Whether you are a government opponent (i.e., this shows the depth of people’s frustration with the current order), a cynic (i.e., such talk is tolerated because everyone knows it will make no difference), or a government supporter (i.e., this proves that this government has given people real democracy and freedom of speech), you should celebrate these videos for what they are: a demonstration that political thought is alive and well in Pakistan (irrespective of whether you believe its content to be righteous or misguided).
Coming from the bol ke lab aazad hain tairay school of democracy, to me the space for dissent is itself important to the democratic polity; for that reason alone I beleive that these are important articulations.
For those who are unaware or believe that syllabus of Madaris is backward and based on 100$% religious and Anti-Shia stuff,They should read this article printed in 21st October Jang . If this is all true then IMO, This is really a good and balanced Syllabus for a religious institute,specially when they teach logics ,books by Christians etc.
“Haq bahu, baishak bahu!”
[quote post="362"]of a bigot[/quote]
Ah personal attack! Thanks to prove my point about Liberals that they don’t sound less ignorant than psuedo religious people. *grin*
[quote post="362"]bigot[/quote]
Dude, the day you learn and understand the Meaning of this word, you will start hating and cursing yourself so severely that you would forget to care what world thinks about you, till then bye. *grin*.
One of my favorite quote is: “The mind of a bigot is like the pupil of an eye. The more light you shine on it the narrower it gets.”
[quote post="362"]I simply quoted a historical fact that the[/quote]
[quote post="362"]you might like to read an authentic history of that period.[/quote]
*grin*. Sure. Now would you like to tell that authentic source or even the “source” only?
I would quote Quran here.
Quran(53:19-23)
-Have you then considered the Lat and the Uzza
-And Manat, the third, the last?
-What! for you the males and for Him the females!
-This indeed is an unjust division!
-These are nothing but names which ye have devised,- ye and your fathers,- for which Allah has sent down no authority (whatever). They follow nothing but conjecture and what their own souls desire!- Even though there has already come to them Guidance from their Lord!
and regarding name of Allah
To Allah belong the most beautiful names so call Him with them and leave those who deviate with regard to His names. They will be repaid that which they used to do.} [quran: 7: 180 ]
and IN the light of this verse I was actually giving my opinion that why would I prefer to call Allah rather some other language name like kHuda, Elohim etc etc.
[quote post="362"]are also pre-Islamic[/quote]
Muhammad(Saw) was NOT the first muslim neither Islam came in this world after Muhammad’s Prophecy.
[quote post="362"]Islamic rituals, like Hajj [/quote]
Answered above. The first man who ever performed Tawaf around Ka’ba was none other than Adam[AS] after its construction. Same thing then was practised by Abraham(AS) and His sons.
————–
Offcourse people who believe in that:
-Exposing women is sign of freedom[PIA thread for reference and pathetic thing was that Women was getting agreed with it *sigh* ]
-Allowing Alcohol in the name of minority protection.
-Arguing about verse in which Quran allowed men for 4 marriages and one lady on a forum who visit and comment on this site as well had issues that why women were not allowed to keep 4 husbands and when someone told that it could create issue of authenticity of father of child(ren), she siad that DNA could be used for solving the issue. Somone tell tht *naive* woman tht when laws re written, they are written to keep everyone in mind rather individual. if some of defence resident violates RED light of signal by saying that he’s more educated than a lalukhait area person then such violations cancels the concept of laws. Does it not sound good that majority in Pakistan DO know name of their Dads unlike USA?
are liberals
copycats of Westfor me and I always dislike such loonies of my society.[quote comment="4860"]” … and MastQalander who came up with theory that God “Allah” was one of the God of pagans etc etc.”[/quote]
Adnan Siddiqi Sahib,
I did not come up with a theory, I simply quoted a historical fact that the Arab pagans also believed in a high God, among so many other lesser gods, whom they called Allah. Did you ever ponder over the fact that the name of the father of the Prophet of Islam was Abdallah? And did you know that some of the Islamic rituals, like Hajj and the names of the months, are also pre-Islamic? When you find time, you might like to read an authentic history of that period.
[quote]“if calling a spade a spade is not a polite way then I don’t mind at all.” [/quote]
Well, Adnan Sahib, there is a difference between calling a spade a spade and calling it a goddamn shovel.
Sincerely,
MQ
@Liberal: why disguise? why are you hiding yourself?
I am clear enough who are liberals ofr me.Some exist on this mighty website as well who condemn many Islamic stuff by preaching their theories like one produced by Bilal Zuberi who got irked due to fajar azaan and MastQalander who cameup with theory that God “Allah” was one of the God of pagans etc etc.
[quote post="362"]Or is it just that you have an urge to abuse someone and vent needless anger that leads to these comments?[/quote]
Abuse? its a plain blame over me. Where were you hiding when such *abuse* is thrown against
Islamist.?[quote post="362"]Sometimes I wonder if maybe you are a hidden-liberal yourself [/quote]
Definately i am not a mullah but I am not a liberal as well, please don’t curse and abuse me. I would rather like to be follower of some XYZ religion and stick its rules rather beliving in theories given by West or anyone else for my religion. I am in the middle, neither a religious zealot to send someone for some so called ‘Jihad’ neither i am a desi liberal who don’t mind to interpret Quran for their own while grabbing a wine glass in other hand. for me both cabals are unacceptable and are on extreeme.
[quote post="362"]But you know what, I know too many ‘mullahs’ who are entirely polite and reasonable, who are not always angry and dont always make hurtful comments. May you be like them too one day. Ameen[/quote]
if calling a spade a spade is not a polite way then I don’t mind at all. as you know you can always block me to comment on it but I wouldnt use someone else’ tone to express my words.
Ali Naqvi, as a rhetorical device by benuria student uses the slogan ‘Pakistan ka matlab kiya’ very nicely. He knows it cannot be challenged and it essentially tries to make redundant the discussion on either Pakistan or even ‘La illaha …’ As if both are known quantities. They are, of course, not. The fact is that the religious leaders opposed Pakistan on a premise that Islam doe snot condone the idea of the state and instead the whole ummah is one. So a state that was made for MUSLIMS (as opposed to for Islam) in a certain geographic region was not worth supporting. Once Pakistan became reality they have worked mostly to turn it from a state of mostly MUSLIMS in to a state about ISLAM. Hence the ‘discovery’ of this slogan during the Zia era. I would ask people here who are older than the Zia era to think of when they first started hearing this line. It was in the Zia days when to legitimize his vision this slogan suddenly was seen everywhere, including on TV immediately after and before the 9 O’clock news. Now you have a whole generation who either does not know or has been made to forget that this slogan was neither that important in the politics of 1947 (was used a few times, but not a central slogan) nor really until Zia came along.