Adil Najam
Since yesterday the “I” word - impeachment - has begun to be thrown around a lot.
Some quarters seem to think that it just happen this time. Others suggest that it is more talk than action and the numbers needed to pull this are still not there.
Coming out of the “critical” Nawaz Sharif-Asif Zardari meetings one keeps wondering how much of this is an effort to keep the coalition going and how much is a real push to change the essential political equations of Pakistan. There are reports that Gen. Musharraf is taking this move seriously enough to cancel his trip to China (to attend the Olympics opening ceremony). On the other hand some of Gen. Musharraf’s supporters are claiming that no such cancellation has happened. We do know, however, that he is taking this challenge seriously and lining up his supporters.
All in all, there is too much noise to say what is happening. But something is clearly happening. Does the PPP-PML(N) have the numbers they need to go ahead? Does the President have the numbers he needs to stop it? And what of all the external actors and where they may lean, why and for what?
Interestingly, we had run a ATP Poll back in June asking you what you thought would have happened to Gen. Musharraf by October 2008? The majority (38%) had thought that he would be impeached by then. A significant number (31%) thought that by October 2008 we woudl be still muddling through as we are now.
We do not intend to open the Poll again, but it does seem that either of those two answers could turn out to be true again. Indeed, even our earlier Poll on the subject, from October 2007, may still be relevant in its results!
So, since we can’t make full sense of exactly what all of this adds up to, we thought we woudl ask our best source: You. What do you think? What is happening? What might happen? And why?
Amina from the north, no it is not difficult to understand at all. It is very simple, if you only think about it.
Zardari and Nawaz Sharif will not impeach the Musharraf. The Parliament will. that’s what it is suppose to do. I guess you have gotten unaccustomed to a parliament that actually does its job. Like kicking out an illegal President.
Simple enough, isn’t it.
i don’t get it.If the president was illegal elected, are the two guys(naawzdari) who are not in the parliament are legally allow to impeach the president???????????????????? It is just a question , do we really have any constitution.
With due respect to Mr Ahmad R Shahid’s opinions I was merely pointing out the comparison between the two, namely Chengez Khan and Radovan Karadz.
First of all, who would bring impeachment proceedings against Chengez Khan. His own people? Another power - that at the time did not exist to challenge his authority? And for Radovan Karadz its not impeachment but he is being brought to justice by outside authority at the behest of another power. Can any power, today, bring Bush or Blair to justice for their alleged crimes against humanity. Can any one bring some Israeli General to International Court for his crimes against humanity? No they can not!! On the other hand “yes” if there was a power capable of doing so.
As for impeachment of Nixon and Clinton don’t forget it was internal politics and not for crimes against humanity. They may talk about bringing impeachment proceedings against their president, as you say, for even minor crimes but my point would still be no one can bring them to justice like they have done to Radovan Karadz. Therefore impeachment and bringing or making Chnengez Khan or Radovan Karadz accountable for crimes against humanity are different things.
Another thing the reason no one talks about Bush Snr is that he attacked Iraq when the whole world was of the opinion that it is to free Kuwait. And he did not go beyond that despite causing destruction etc. Whereas, Iraq Jnr attacked for alleged weapons of mass destructions. That is the difference!!!
I don’t know about you guys but the announcement of the coalition partners to impeach our self proclaimed Messiah sounded like music to my ears. The way Zardari pronounced and lay stress on the declaration for the impeachment of ‘General Pervez Musharraf’ sounded like the opening bars of Beethoven’s fifth symphony: ‘did did did da’ which you may know stands for the letter ‘V’ in morse code and the letter ‘V’ is a sign of ‘Victory’.
Hope and pray the scorned relic of our past is consigned to the dust bin of history never to rise again. Before that the KHABIS should be stoned to death for raping and embarrasing a nation in the comity of nations to deter others who may dare to follow in his foot steps. For this stoning there should be no bar on a person to throw the first stone who may have himself commited a sin since such is the nature of the sins commited by this most ugly and sinister Messiah.
At the same time be watchful of Zardari. His decision to impeach Mush first and to restore the judges later looks bit fishy to me though the media has not made much of it. Logically the judges should have been restored before the impeachment.
Please also join me in my brief prayer: Oh, God save us from the protection of our protectors (You know who).
Musaarraf should not only be impeached but he should be given punishment he deserves for break the constitution ,damaged judiciary,held in house arrest chief justice with his children and other sixty judges of judiciary,illegally elected himself as president for next five years from the out going asemblies,sold pakistanies to American Govt,killed women in habsa mosque by bombing,and throwing chemicals to burn them,killed pakistanis mostly civilians women and children in NWFP/FATA/BALUCHISTAN,allow Americns airforce and soldiers to enter in pakistan,without consulting people of pakistan.
@Shafiq
As for Bush I agree with you. But in that respect I think we should look at American history. Bush Sr. also attacked Iraq but its only Bush Jr. whom people are even talking about impeachment. And that is definitely a marked improvement over leaders who were responsible for the mass extermination of Red Indians but no body even thought about impeaching them. Nixon was to be impeached for just the tapping of a phone and Clinton for his affair with Lewinsky, far lesser crimes than that of Bush. But in future, given the historical trend, I believe that American Presidents would be impeached for even lesser crimes than what Bush has done.
Ahmad R Shaid’s comparison between Chengez Khab and Radovan Karadz is misconceived.
The reasons no one could charge Chengez Khan for crimes against humanity was because there was no one who could stand up against him. If Radovan Karadz had the same power today could anyone charge him? Definitely not!!!
There are certain human rights group who believe that Bush has also committed crimes against humanity and Bush should be charged. But the reality is it cant’s be done!!!
@Aqil Sajjad
In view of your letter that appeared in The News today and your reply to my comments I wish to state that I think that restoration of judiciary would have been the ideal way of doing things but idealism can’t always be followed so the second best or the third best options have to be weighed and in that sense I think impeachment of Musharraf is of paramount importance.
As for giving him the safe exit and the evolution of institutions, I believe that once again the ideal solution would be to try him for treason under Article 6 of the constitution. But if that can’t be done then at least try to impeach him under whatever options are available and I believe that even this act would make future mis-adventures less probable. The reason being that previously the military dictators were never been impeached. So its a historical improvement over the past. Further historical improvement would come in the future when a head of the state or the government won’t just be impeached but punished for his/her crimes.
Historically Chengez Khan was never punished for his crimes but Radovan Karadži? has been convicted for similar crimes. The difference between the two is that of time. At the time of Changez Khan no one would have even thought of convicting him for crimes against humanity. Now it is very much possible. That’s what historical evolution is. Humanity always takes time to learn.
Many such examples can be quoted from history where people in the past were not punished but increasingly they are being punished. Any mistakes in the future by political leaders would be severely punished even thouth AZ, NS, BB have never faced any “real” ehtesab of their mis-doings, which as we can see are aplenty.