Pakistanis Die. Pakistanis Cry. Again.

Posted on August 21, 2008
Filed Under >Adil Najam, Law & Justice, Society
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Adil Najam

Pakistan is in tears today. Yet again.

70+ people are dead in Wah today, as yet another cursed suicide bomber targets Pakistan and Pakistanis. The Tehrik-i-Taliban has taken responsibility for them. Only two days ago, 32 people were killed in a suicide attack on a hospital in the northern town of Dera Ismail Khan. Meanwhile incursions and attacks into Pakistani territory by American forces continue and fighting between militants and Pakistani forces rages in Bajur and other areas, killing even more.

In what continues to be war on and in Pakistan, Pakistanis continue to die. Pakistan continues to cry.

Some will call it the largest legacy of the Musharraf years. Some will read unstated messages within this murder and mayhem by these killers. Others will see it as the price in dead bodies that Pakistan pays in the War on Terror. Yet others will remind us that this is reaping what Gen. Zia-ul-haq sowed. There will be, I am sure, plenty more pontifications too – ranging from the absurd to the absurdly profound.

All I know is that today, yet again, Pakistanis die. Pakistan continues to cry.

Why must this murder and mayhem continue? I ask. When will it end? These, of course, are absurd questions themselves. Because we all know the answers. It will continue for as long as we let the killers kill and support their murders with our silence. Silence, of course, also kills. And some are condemned to cry silently.

120 Comments on “Pakistanis Die. Pakistanis Cry. Again.”

  1. Rizwan says:
    August 21st, 2008 1:23 pm

    Time to put differences behind and focus on real issues , I even think Judge issue should be put behind for the same reason. Let Zardari be the first to be on top and the first to be down. MQM is not dumb.

  2. August 21st, 2008 1:24 pm

    I am not even sorry to say, but I don’t think Pakistan, economy, politics, government etc will grow or improve at sustainable levels. Time and Time again, various events have occurred which has led me to conclude that.

    Granted I was not present in the first 30 decades of this creation and I wont be present after another few decades to see if I was right or wrong, but I am not sure if Pakistan will be Pakistan by then either.

  3. QASMI says:
    August 21st, 2008 1:25 pm

    Beautifully written.

    This is challenge number one and issue number one for Pakistan. Everything else is secondary. I do not care what Zardari or Nawaz do personally but they must focus on this war against Pakistan now and stop it. Musharraf has sown these seeds of hatred and it will not be easy to undo what he has done, but an elected government certainly has a better chance to create a united Pakistan against these Taliban murderers.

  4. August 21st, 2008 1:28 pm

    Actually, to follow up with my earlier comment.

    I always have a glimmer of hope, virtually every week. But these sort of events, the deteriorating conditions in the country, the carelessness (as in politicians not giving a $hit about the citizens) etc., leads me to change my stance.

  5. Qasim says:
    August 21st, 2008 1:34 pm

    How can the Pakistanis condemn this?

    They have their own lives to worry about. If this sounds selfish, and it probably is, that’s too bad – but this is also the reality. When the internal structure of Pakistan is repaired and strengthened into a functioning society – only then can some semblance of normalcy be even achieved. Right now, the Pakistanis lead a chaotic life. At the highest levels, the judiciary has been sacked, preventing all the citizens of Pakistan from obtaining any kind of justice, should a case even develop from the cobwebbed registers of the corrupt policemen. And at the lowest levels, we have these suicide bombings, which will continue as long as Pakistan is weak in its governance.

  6. Salman says:
    August 21st, 2008 1:46 pm

    Adil, Very touch words. Is it easy to pinpoint who is at fault here? I just find it odd that these problems have increased right after Musharraf resigning. Call me a fool but I do not accept the simple answer to who is at fault.

    I was reading an article today of the problems in Georgia and how initially the Russians were being accused of starting the war. Now articles are being published to say otherwise:

    http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=13285

    Though the article maybe a bit biased, it makes one wonder of the reality. Could the situation be any different of what we are seeing in Pakistan?

    No, I am not in denial that Muslims can kill each other but all I am asking us is to reflect.

  7. Allah Wasaya says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:01 pm

    I for one am hugely disappointed at our so called military might for which we have been singing praises all our lives. If these are the results from an institution that eats up a lion’s share of a country’s finances, then of course the rest of the country has a very valid excuse of under performing. This attack on POF is a huge slap rather spit in the face of our armed forces, and I sure hope that it serves as a wake up call for our Generals in GHQ and declare it an all out war, and use the real soldiers (if at all there are any) in lieu of those shalwar kameez clad jawans armed with an AK.

    Bohat shor suntay thay pehlu main dil ka..

    sorry I am extremly disgusted.

  8. Anwar says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:04 pm

    There is a Taliban group headed by Mashud and supported by US and India that is clearly involved in anti-Pakistan activities. Pakistani government had complained to the Americans about this group but the support continues.. The goal of recent bombing is to force Pakistan army to launch a full scale war against all Talibans. Before getting sucked in this whirlpool, a very thorough analysis of the situation is needed followed by political support and maturity.
    State also needs to show its resolve.

  9. abdullah says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:10 pm

    My heart weeps !!!
    Tragedies like Wah explosion are happening every now and then and now a terrorist group is openly and blatantly accepting the responsibility.
    The reason behind these explosions given by the terrorist group is that Pakistan Army should stop the “military action ” in Waziristan and other tribal areas.
    The question is that how long these murders and mayhem will continue?
    INDEFINITELY, till we stop criticizing the Government action on LAL MASJID which was a very right action of the government to eliminate terrorists men or women alike from the society of Pakistan.
    These murders will continue till we do not support our forces as one nation to go any where and kill all those bastards who are responsible for killing innocent people in hundreds and physically crippling innocent people in thousands.
    I request General Kiyani to wipe out all these miscreants in the tribal areas of Bajor and Waziristan and where ever they can be found in SWAT or any place. Ofcourse Pakistani army has the power and the sources to blast these terrorists.
    Worst come for worst if Pakistan has to take physical assistance from America it should take to root out the evil once for all.
    If we don’t ask our forces to go all out against these cold blooded terrorists then we will weep every other day.

  10. ANGRY says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:29 pm

    these daily bombings are Musharraf’s gift to Pakistan. Curse him and his legacy. It will take so many years to clean the hatred and mess he has created in our country.

  11. Umar says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:29 pm

    Wah is my hometown… I left two years ago to come study here in the US… I still can’t get through to my mother on the phone, but another relative got through and told us she and other relatives were fine… but its a very disconcerting feeling when they strike this close to home…

    What is worrying and disheartening is that so many of us (going by the comments on BBCUrdu for instance) are unwilling to place the blame on the Taliban… instead, they whine about the government not doing enough to provide security… yet, when the government tries to take the Taliban on (however half-heartedly), the same people cry out about the government killing their “apnay log”… such people should ask what sort of “apnay log” go around slaughtering innocents in this manner (being from Wah, I can testify to the fact that the people who walk or use bicycles to go work at the POF are poor, hardworking folk)… it is time for pro-Taliban ignorant fools to stop blaming conspiracies, foreign hands, agencies and the like, and say it out loud: all these acts are being perpetrated by the Taliban… they’ve admitted these attacks and the one on our Shia brethren in D.I. Khan… these Taliban will not just disappear if the operations against them stop in FATA… instead, stopping the operations will further embolden them… the only solution for the Taliban mayhem lies with the bullet… one bullet for each Talib…

  12. Rafay Kashmiri says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:37 pm

    @as said earlier these are not Talibans,
    they are BATILANS supported by USA & Indians
    they have nothing to do with Islam and muslims,
    therefore, liable of severe punishment, they must
    be crushed these Batilans which contains every
    anti-Islam element. We must demand united action
    against these agents.

  13. Eidee Man says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:50 pm

    Like others have said, this is extremely sad news. I check Dawn.com every morning, and believe me, I have developed the habit of saying a silent “no bombs” prayer during the few seconds it takes for the page to load. How did we get into the current state of affairs where even a single week without suicide bombings is considered a victory?

    Musharraf is definitely not my favorite person, but I don’t think we can put the blame on him, entirely. We, as a country, have been damned with this “strategic” location since the beginning. Unless something drastic happens, I don’t see how we’re going to come out of this mess anytime soon. All we can hope for at the moment, is for Osama to be found, so the U.S. administration can have an excuse to scale back its operations in Afghanistan.

    But if that doesn’t happen, I think the government should just withdraw the military. We may lose billions in aid, but heck, at least our people will still be alive.

  14. naseer says:
    August 21st, 2008 2:54 pm

    Innocent people lost their lives, they did not commit any crimes, niether involve in any conspiracy just going to make their rizk (bread), they were killed by Taliban and Taliban admitted that.
    So now what Taliban’s are , merciless, bloodthirsty killers no muslim will ever link them to the teachings of Holy Prophet, no matter whatever the circumstances are……
    Taliban should be declared kafirs by all muslim scholars if they have a shred of islamic spirit.

  15. Umar says:
    August 21st, 2008 3:05 pm

    Well, one benefit of Musharraf’s departure is that those of us on what can be termed the liberal/left end of the political spectrum in Pakistan have been rid of the massive Musharraf millstone hanging around our necks… say one word against the Mullahs and you are immediately accused of being pro-Musharraf/US/Israel/India… the flip side is that saying anything anti-Musharraf used to make one pro-mullah… some people see the world in black and white…

    While it needs to be said that these Taliban are the results of what the army and the ISI have been doing for decades now, it shouldn’t stop at that… now that these Taliban exist, (and they do exist because of the army creating, arming, funding and encouraging them, to this day), they will not go away simply by commenting on why they are there… Pakistan (more specifically the army) created this Frankenstein’s monster which is killing people the world over, and the onus lies with us in finishing it…

    No peace deals will work with these barbarians… instead, as they did over the last year, they will simply kill off all pro-government tribal Maliks… today, they have also killed a senior ANP leader in Swat, and accepted responsibility for it… when they sign peace deals, they expect the government to stop doing anything, while they themselves can carry on in their merry ways…

    Given their association with the army and the ISI in the past (and one would think, the present), it is hypocritical of them to go around claiming they are taking the army on… even if one were to accept that for the sake of argument, one has to wonder what lies next… those who support these barbarians should ask themselves if they are willing to live in a Pakistan where girls can’t go to school because the Taliban have burnt them, where women have acid thrown on their faces, where all forms of entertainment is banned, and all the other “benefits” that the people currently living under the Taliban yoke are enjoying…

    As for innocents dying in air force attacks on FATA, it is because these Taliban are using those innocents as human shields… such bravery!

  16. Shirjeel says:
    August 21st, 2008 3:09 pm

    Senseless! Barbaric! Total butchery!

    No religion in world approves of such kind of mayhem and violence where only innocent people die. Islam, a religion of peace and understanding, in particular rejects such killings.

    There is an urgent need of a country-wide campaign involving all segments of the society especially our religious ulemas and political parties to reject this kind of violence and call such practices as totally out of the ambit of Islamic teachings. We need to do something earnestly to stop the brainwashing and exploitation of our youths who are being turned into suicide bombers by these so called ‘Talibans’.

  17. Aamir Ali says:
    August 21st, 2008 3:10 pm

    These bombings happen because Pakistanis are a nation of cowards who hold everyone but the bombers responsible for their actions.

    If Pakistani awam had supported the war on terrorism, we would not be seeing this today.

  18. Nihari says:
    August 21st, 2008 4:15 pm

    In the early days of Islam, there was a sect called Kharaji..they were responsible for the shahadat of Hazrat Ali. They were the fitna of that time. And they were the puritans. They thought they were following the real Islam. Talibans are nothing but a carbon copy of the fitna. They should be dealth with accordingly.

  19. Rizwan says:
    August 21st, 2008 4:29 pm

    Aamir
    past is past we must unite and support good things by present Government if any for the sake of better Pakistan.

  20. Mustafa says:
    August 21st, 2008 4:50 pm

    No muslim will engage in this kind of senseless violence.

  21. z malik says:
    August 21st, 2008 5:44 pm

    Pak Army should engage in target killimg of Taliban leadership and then negotiate with their supporters.
    Indiscriminate bombing will not solve the problem and may actually worsen the situation.

  22. Mohammad Farooq says:
    August 21st, 2008 6:00 pm

    The tendency to deny the problem and blame it on outsiders not only does not solve teh problem, it worsens it because it distracts us from the real causes.

    In recent days we have seen how Musharraf-supporters and Musharraf-opponents have been at each other’s throats. The lesson from today is that it is really these religious fanatics and fundamentalists who remain the true enemies of Pakistan and are out to destroy Pakistan. Whatever we think about Musharraf or about Zardari, against these murders we must remain united.

  23. Amber says:
    August 21st, 2008 6:04 pm

    The answer to killing is not more killing. It is thinking also about why they are doing this and addressing the underlying reasons. f everyone kills everyone else, then no one remains at the end!

  24. Asim says:
    August 21st, 2008 6:06 pm

    True, Pakistanis dies and Pakistanis Cries!
    Since Musharaf is out of picture, the fight should be against
    the army on battle field, why they cant kill n fight in war and
    attacking innocent people and taking their lives.

    If Tehrik-i-Taliban has taken responsibility , they sure are not among pakistanis nor muslims who are killing pakistani in pakistan. As the fight should be against government on war ground. They cannot fight the battle nor protect their homes so they are crowdly targeting innocent people.

    They must kill the person who started this war in pakistan before target any innocent muslim.

    These suiciders are not pakistanis nor muslim, May Allah help us All to save our pakistan and our nation.

  25. Ghulam Ali says:
    August 21st, 2008 6:14 pm

    These Taliban leaders are now openly threatening Pakistan and have declared war on the people of Pakistan. They are also at war with Islam. They are distorting Islam and making it something that it never was. These are remanants of the same people that never wanted Pakistan.

    A war against Taliban, is a war FOR Pakistan and also a war FOR Islam.

  26. Jarnail says:
    August 21st, 2008 6:38 pm

    These Taliban are the enemies of Pakistan. They are also enemy of Islam.

    If they are not stopped they will destroy Pakistan and destroy Islam.

    They must be stopped by all means.

  27. Ibrahim says:
    August 21st, 2008 7:20 pm

    I wish the post on Aafia Siddiqi had been written with the same passion, emotions and anger. But, no! Objectivity rules, but this objectively goes out of the window when it comes to attacks in Pakistan. Where is the objectivity here? Aafia’s post needed lack of emotions, but this post has to be full of it? Btw, there should be emotions for reporting both stories.

    What Talibans are doing is indeed wrong, not because what West thinks or what man-made ‘human rights’ and laws have been breached, but because it is against Islam. That’s it. Killing woman, children and innocent people is not from Islam and Taliban have come to believed this is justified in the name for fighting the enemies of Islam, like the Pakistani governtment, and this is a bidat in the religion. Almost all the scholars agree on this.

    Taliban are making a huge mistake by practicing this bidat, and by disobeying Alalh they will alienate people who have faith in them in Pakistan. By killing children and women in the name of revenge is not the answer and they must fear Allah for this action.

    So, Taliban are misguided on this issue, but as Muslims we must share their desire to implement shariah. Taliban and tribal people in general are known to keep their words. So, if army stops killings Muslim up north, Talibans will stop, as they have demonstrated. Did Taliban one day got up and started attacks in Pakistan? No, it was the pathetic army which attacked them day in and day out which led them to commit wrong themselves.

    This pathetic website only shows one picture. Yes, many innocent people have been killed by Taliban attacks, but have we paid attention to what goes on almost everyday up north? What stops people to not show both sides.

    Taliban by doing these attacks on civilian have innocent blood on their hands and the Pakistani govt/army has innocent blood on their hands. But, it is the Pakistani army who has to stop first because it started it. Yes, Taliban could stop attacks because two wrongs don’t make a right, but you can’t expect rational actions when you are being attacked and your mosques, children, women, elderly, houses and businesses have been destroyed.

    And, people, it is not about ‘Pakistani’ dying. It’s about innocent people dying. The way Adil and his friends always push this ‘Pakistani’ label makes it seem like the victims of Pak. army up north are less deserving of our sorrow than the victims of Taliban. What a shame.

    Nihari…Khawaarij didn’t kill Ali only. They killed Uthmaan also. They attacked Muawiyah as well but he survived and they mistakenly killed the servant of Amr bin al-Aas (may Allah be pleased with them all). And, you know very little. These attacks (this action) of Taliban is like that of khawaarij, but Talibans are not khawaarij. Do you know the most fundamental thing that is needed for one to be known as khawaarij?

  28. Ibrahim says:
    August 21st, 2008 7:23 pm

    May Allah have mercy on those who were killed and give patience to their families.

  29. Fahad says:
    August 21st, 2008 7:53 pm

    I think we need to crush these Taliban. NOT FOR AMERICA, but for PAKISTAN.

    Tell Americans we dont want their support or money for this. And do it for ourselves. Then people will have no excuse not to support the war against their enemies of Pakistan. Today too many people argue that this is for USA so it is not our war. BUT REALLY IT IS.

  30. Qarar says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:10 pm

    I am sorry, but it is pathetic to see this guy Ibrahim defending the Taliban murderers. That is what is wrong, too many people make excuses for the actions of these murderers and enemies of Pakistan.

  31. sidhas says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:17 pm

    It is sad a day for Pakistanis all humanity across the globe. Will Pakistanis wake up?

  32. Usman Ali says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:20 pm

    A few people here are still fooling themselves by saying that outside countries are behind this. BUT THE TALIBAN HAVE THEMSELVES CLAIMED THEY DID IT AND ALSO THEY HAVE THREATENED THAT THEY WILL KILL EVEN MORE MUSLIMS AND PAKISTANIS IN THE FUTURE. That is what they are saying, guys!

  33. Zia says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:32 pm

    Talibans are simply cold blooded killers who kill innocent people anywhere. They must be rooted out with full force that can be employed. On top of it these guys have the guts to come on TV and admit it and our media earns cash and give them what they want and government sits and watches and ‘condemns’. Its always common people who have to pay the price.

  34. Riaz Haq says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:38 pm

    It is time for Pakistanis to stop being ambivalent about the Taliban and join the fight. The Taliban perpetrating these atrocities in the name of Islam are criminals and thugs. They are no friends of Islam, Muslims or Pakistan and they must be stopped, not for America’s sake, but for the sake of Pakistan.
    Please read my post at http://www.riazhaq.com/2008/07/yet-another-peace-deal-amidst-shia.html to get the full picture of Taliban’s ambitions and the ineptitude of our current leadership.

  35. sidhas2000 says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:39 pm

    We have to come up with a strategy to defeat the hopless message of Radical Islam.

    I am afraid that unless we have a vision and resolve, the appeal of radical Islam will stop at nothing.

    This is a fight that will not and can not be win without a clear strategy.

    There is a lot of support for Radical Islam in Pakistan. Over past decades starting from Zia, we have raised a generation that knows nothing but violence.

    This is a war that we will be fighting for long time.

    Among ourselves, lets think through how to defeat the forces of darkness.

  36. Junaid says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:58 pm

    Pakistani army plus Pakistani army supported Taliban are showing their true colors.

    Both of them are murderers of the highest order.

    And those who condemn one without condemning the other are party to the murders and genocides carried out by both parties.

    Junaid

  37. Khurram Farooqui says:
    August 21st, 2008 8:58 pm

    Dear Ibrahim,

    Your comment seems disingenuous… faulting the Taliban for their tactics, yet agreeing with their ultimate cause, the implementation of a shariah system in Pakistan (and perhaps to do away with the artificial geopolitical boundaries of nations and form a united khilafat).

    The problem is, which version of shariah will they impose? What about those of us who consider ourselves muslims but do not believe that the version of Islam that the Taleban preach is Islam at all? I am glad that you think that killing innocent people is wrong. What about burning schools for women? What about threatening people who shave their beards? In your eyes, what level of coercion and force is acceptable?

    You do not speak for me, and if you truly believe in the cause of the Taleban then your version of Islam is not my version of Islam. Please do not preach to me about who is the enemy of Islam and who isn’t. I can make up my own mind.

  38. Riaz Haq says:
    August 21st, 2008 9:26 pm

    Some of the comments here seem to suggest that the Taliban have been provoked into their murderous rampage in Pakistan. These comments also suggest moral equivalence between the actions of Pak military and the actions of the Taliban. Let me say the following to all such commentators:

    Let’s not be blind to the wave of deadly suicide bombings in Pakistan and the rest of the world unleashed by your jihadist friends who have killed large numbers of innocent, nameless, faceless people, mainly Muslims, and innocent civilians of other faiths.

    Let us not be blind to the threats issued by your Lal Masjid friends to Najam Sethi recently and many more in the past. A bold attempt to muzzle the media by a non-state entity.

    Let us not be blind to the broadcast threats of your radical Lal Masjid friends who threatened to throw acid in the un-veiled faces of Muslim women in Islamabad during their reign of terror.

    Let us not be blind to the desecration of masjids in Pakistan by your friends who turned them into arms depots and launch pads for attacks against fellow Muslims who disagreed with their extreme interpretation of Sharia.

    Let us not be blind to those who are trying to impose their violent version of Shariah by the force of arms.

    Let us not be blind to the atrocities Taliban and Al-Qaeda and their sympathizers have committed against the poor Aghans during their short rule and later, particularly against the weak including women and girls whose schools have been shut down or burned down. or the barber shops which have been shut or burned down for shaving men’s facial hair.

    Let us not be blind to the fact that any one, including Musharaf ( and I admit he is no angel) , who challenged your extremist friends engaged in violence against fellow Muslims, has become the object of hate by you.

    Let us not be blind to the to the fact that your radical “Islamic” friends have done more to damage the name and perception of Islam and Muslims than any one else in the history of the world.

  39. American Muslim says:
    August 21st, 2008 10:08 pm

    Solution for Pakistan’s problem:

    Be honest and show moral courage.

    CALL SPADE A SPADE.

    Identify the root cause of current problem.

    I know the cause and i have solution to it.

    If moderators allow me, i can post it.

  40. Salim says:
    August 21st, 2008 10:13 pm

    When I was in medical school a few outsiders would put on Physician garb for their own nefarious activities. They duped patients. They preyed on innocent and often ailing girls. They bullied sundry at will. Well these bearded hoodlums who call themselves Talibans are really pure murderers in disguise. They kill for hire at the beck and call of anyone who will pay their cheap price. If there ever were any real Talibans they have been eliminated by these bestial beings. For the innocent and unprotected to live without fear these sub-humans need be caged and disposed urgently.

  41. S H says:
    August 21st, 2008 10:44 pm

    @ Salim, May I ask what is a sub-human? Is this a new species?

    Amazing now we have experts, that know it all. All of a sudden everyone is an expert. Be it Islam, Taliban and military strategies. You name it, we have them here. A lot smarter people than us here have been dealing with these issues for the past 20 plus years and they cannot find a solution.

    This is a time for mourning and let be just that. All this chatter will be stifled after the Nov elections here in the US. Start using your brains, for most of you are no different than the pathetic Talibani fanatics; easily incited and ready to go for the kill.

  42. Rasheed says:
    August 22nd, 2008 12:45 am

    Ask yourself why?

  43. Kalsoom says:
    August 22nd, 2008 1:10 am

    I think the bombing today was sad, mainly because we as a country have not truly come together as a nation to fight this ideological and tangible war against militancy. Why is it the conflict is seen as the military’s war, the U.S. war, but not our war? What will it take for us to identify with this conflict and take ownership of it. Only through a unified approach (government + military + people) will we be able to tackle this problem, and Pakistani civilians can stop falling victim to this war.

  44. August 22nd, 2008 2:49 am

    is it our war now.

  45. Khalid says:
    August 22nd, 2008 2:54 am

    It was always our war.

  46. Qasim says:
    August 22nd, 2008 5:33 am

    > The problem is, which version of shariah will they impose?

    The funny thing is, that Quaid-e-Azam advocated that Pakistan be a state where full freedom of religious, cultural and ethnic rights be maintained and allowed. Nothing but a secular state would allow that to happen.

    This is very sad news, and this hit me personally as well. I have been to Wah Cantt numerous times. What I found each time I went there was how the place was progressing rapidly through construction. It was a also an unbelievably clean place with scenic views.

    My question to the Pakistan authority is: What will happen in the aftermath of this bomb blast? Whenever an incident of this kind occurs, the politicians produce a round of condemnations, and move onto other things as if nothing happened. Now the central military complex of the country, described one of the most “sensitive places,” has also been rocked by one of the most devastating bomb blasts. First hospitals, sometimes funerals, sometimes police stations and now one of the most guarded places within Pakistan – the military complex, has been attacked. There truly is no safe place in Pakistan right now.

  47. Sad Pakistani says:
    August 22nd, 2008 7:39 am

    Saying all this while sitting in the foreign lands does nothing to the improvement of the situation, I believe. I read through these comments and they sound so similar to political slogans we

  48. Azher says:
    August 22nd, 2008 10:15 am

    This issue is more complicated than many comments here make it. A BIG part of the problem is that ther eis a large and growing community in Paksitan of religious parties like Jamaat, JUI, even PML(N), and of these born-again types who de facto support the cause of these extremists. Not by actual action but by convuluting Islam to justify these murderous actions. And there are too many of these people. Thea re everywhere, in every family, in every comment section, and growing. They are not ACTIVE supporters but they essentially create a false argument that somehow these Taliban were “forced” to take up these murders and its really not tehir fault. These people are teh real support base of these killers and enemies of Pakistan. Until their argument and strength is somehow controlled and reversed, the taliban will keep growing.

  49. Kiran says:
    August 22nd, 2008 10:33 am

    I really don’t understand the problem with these lunatics. Why don’t they settle in Afghanistan and leave us alone. The most funny thing is that they say they are fighting in the way of Allah. You got to be kidding me. Dont even know the meaning of Jihad. Silly people!! Because of them Muslims are called terrorists all over the world. What Islam are they following? They are not Muslims because they have invented their own religion, a religion of terrorism. Only a miracle can save Pakistan from these sick bastards. All we can do is pray for Pakistan.

  50. Khan says:
    August 22nd, 2008 12:00 pm

    It is really time that there be a full crackdown on all Madrassas in Pakistan. It is from there that these generations of killers are emerging. Musharraf’s fault was that he did not clamp down on these mullahs harder when he could have.

  51. lida says:
    August 22nd, 2008 12:16 pm

    These People would kill Quaid-e-Azam because he didn’t have dari and acted western.

    These So called Islamic Fighter should be hunted down and eradicated.

    I say just blame Musharraf ..he seems to be the scape goat for all ills that have befallen Pakistan.

    Mullah rule is what these people want putting 50% of our masses ( women) behind closed doors is their goal.

  52. seema says:
    August 22nd, 2008 1:03 pm

    Adil,

    I agree – we are all complicit in this killing by our silence. So what do you propose we do – all of us sitting here in the US and other countries far away from Pakistan? I am relying on people like you to tell us what to do. I know a lot of us would like to do something actively rather than just wring our hands in despair.
    Please tell the Pakistani diaspora what to do to stop this senseless killing……..

  53. Shahid says:
    August 22nd, 2008 1:56 pm

    Why are we discussing and discussing, and I just read that they blame Pakistan army for Talibans. Yaar main abb kiya kahoun.

    I feel really sad really sad about people mentality who support these stupid people called Taliban. They are jahil ignorant and have no understanding of Islam.

    And I really dont care if they are tribal and known to keep there words. Who cares about this tribal crap. They are full of jahalat.

    Also i wonder who supports these talebans if it was one of your mother or sister or wife or kids in that bomb blast I wonder what you stance would be. I am guessing it wont be so itellectual aint it!

    INNA LILLAHAY WA INNA ILHAY HI RAJEOON.

    Maybe ALLAH give the people whose loved one are lost patiance and show us the right path to Islam.

    I hate these Talebans! And all there supporters! They are not humans nor they are muslims.

  54. Rasheed says:
    August 22nd, 2008 2:00 pm

    Richard bouchers boys are smart and busy these days!

  55. Oracle says:
    August 22nd, 2008 2:44 pm

    Blow Back!

    plain ans simple.

  56. RAZA says:
    August 22nd, 2008 9:29 pm

    From THE NEWS:

    By Ansar Abbasi

    ISLAMABAD: The Central Executive Committee of the Pakistan People’s Party was on Friday informed about the possibility of a woman becoming the country’s president while Aitzaz Ahsan spoke his mind without mincing his words on the wavering policy of the party co-chairperson on the issue of the judges’ restoration.

    According to the party sources, while the dominant majority supported Asif Ali Zardari as the future president of Pakistan, he left his audience guessing by saying that the PPP nominee for the post might be a woman. He did not elaborate and no one enquired from him who that lady could be.

    While Rehman Malik marked his presence by chanting a slogan in favour of the party co-chairperson towards the conclusion of the meeting, it was the day of Aitzaz Ahsan who fearlessly called a spade a spade and warned his party co-chairperson that if he did not restore all the deposed judges immediately, his credibility would be seriously harmed.

    Aitzaz told his top party leader that despite making three pledges, he had not restored the November 2 judiciary, which was harming his credibility. Aitzaz insisted that Asif Ali Zardari should fulfill his commitments with regard to the reinstatement of the judiciary to the November 2 position.

    Although, Asif Ali Zardari was reported to have said that he would get the judges restored, he teased Aitzaz by asking as to what these judges had done to him when he (Zardari) was in jail for nine years. When Aitzaz urged his leader to keep his words, Asif Zardari responded that irrespective of what he had signed or said, he would do what would suit his plan.

    According to these sources, the judges’ issue, the most serious issue threatening the coalition, was generally given cold shoulder by the CEC.Only three members

  57. Harris Siddiqui says:
    August 22nd, 2008 10:28 pm

    Another day in “mumlikat-e-khudadad”. Few dozen other people killed and the nation is finding it hard to blame the culprits. As a human, my heart goes out for the innocent victims, but I will say it out loud on this public forum that we as a nation deserve this.

    We deserve it because we don’t have the ability to recognize our enemies. We deserve it because we don’t have the determination to eradicate those who are hell bent on killing our people. We deserve this because we are a country where our people show up in droves to attend the memorial ceremony of the vilians who died in Lal Masjid ( and our democratically elected government feeds them too) while the families of the real heroes have to remember their sons quietly.

    Our enemies are determined to die for their cause while we sit as confused animals waiting to get slaughtered. I can tell you with 100% certainty that a confused nation can never win this war.

  58. M.R.A. says:
    August 22nd, 2008 10:34 pm

    It does seem that the tide is turning. More and more Pakistanis are realizing that these Taliban Mullah types are really Pakistan’s enemies.

  59. NO-TO-TERROR says:
    August 22nd, 2008 10:47 pm

    I am think that ordinary Pakistanis are realizing that these people preaching hatred in teh name or religion are our true enemies. Enemies of Pakistan and enemies of Islam.

  60. Shazia says:
    August 22nd, 2008 11:16 pm

    Dear Adil Najam, your heartfelt cry of pain and what is happening to our country speaks the feelings of all Pakistanis today. This madness must stop.

  61. Wassalam says:
    August 22nd, 2008 11:19 pm

    Why are all you people blaming the Taliban who are Muslims and not blaming the Americans. They are the ones responsible for these killings.

  62. Worried Pakistani says:
    August 22nd, 2008 11:38 pm

    I read through these comments and wonder if these murders are actualy succeeding. Their mission is to make Pakistani fight other Pakistanis, to divide the people, to have people fight bitterly over nothingness, to destroy the country. They seem to be succeeding in exactly that!

  63. Irfan says:
    August 22nd, 2008 11:49 pm

    I am here on this blog after almost a year. This Blog turned from anti musharraf to love for Musharraf?

  64. Ausaf says:
    August 23rd, 2008 2:35 am

    Pure EVIL!!!!!!!!!…..

  65. Mustafa Kamal says:
    August 23rd, 2008 8:16 am

    People on this forum are jumping on Talibans as if they are the source of all evil in Pakistan. AFAIK, so far Talibans have not been convicted in any court of law. All propaganda against them is based on conjectures and lies. We do not have the courage to say that Americans and Indians are behind the crisis in Pakistan. Therefore we have found an easy scapegoat in poor Talibans. Their only fault is that they are lovers of our Rasool (PBUH) and Islamic values.

    Just think over it:

    If Pakistan is destroyed, do Talibans gain anything? The answer is “No”. They need Pakistan to practice Islam.

    If Pakistan is destroyed, do Indians gain anything? The answer is a resounding “Yes”.

  66. Absar says:
    August 23rd, 2008 9:54 am

    Mustafa Kamal and Wassalam. What world do you live in?

    The Talkban hVe themselves said that they did this. They made the statement to the press. They also said they will kill more Pakistanis. What other proof do you want? You think your favorite custodians of Islam are lying about this?

    These Taliban not only enjoy killing Muslims that is thief mission. Muslims and Islam are the biggest threat to their crazy religion of hatred and murder. What these Taliban and thier apologists believe is certain NOT Islam!

    Their desire to destroy Pakistan same way as they did Afghanistan is also clear. People with these beliefs never wanted Pakistan. That is why the mullahs opposed Pakistan. Their crazy idea of Ummah requires that all countries and states that are Muslim be destroyed first. That is why you see that all Taliban types hate it when people talk abut those country. If people mention Pakistan they hate it because nations don’t fit into their plan and certainly Pakistan does not.

  67. Umar says:
    August 23rd, 2008 10:11 am

    Individuals like Mustafa Kamal and Ibrahim prove what I’ve been saying… that there is plenty of support in Pakistan for these criminals… the war against the Taliban might succeed on the military front, but how will we change the mindset of the Mustafa Kamals and Ibrahims of this world?

    There is a depressing editorial in the Daily Times… it is titled “”Mind Forming” Effect of Terrorism”… after reading the title, I thought the writer would be commenting on how these attacks will perhaps force the pro-Taliban elements in society to see the light of day and call a spade a spade… instead, the editorial contends that it is having the opposite effect… if the writer is correct, it is depressing indeed…

    http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=20088\23\story_23-8-2008_pg3_1

  68. Riaz Haq says:
    August 23rd, 2008 11:41 am

    Unless we acknowledge the growing Taliban threat and join the fight against the ruthless killers, we are all in for a very dark future indeed. Here’s a brief poem by Pastor Martin Niemoller about Nazi Germany:

    In Germany they first came for the Communists,
    and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist.
    Then they came for the trade unionists,
    and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist.
    Then they came for the Catholics,
    and I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant.
    Then they came for the Jews,
    and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew.
    Then they came for me

  69. Mustafa says:
    August 23rd, 2008 4:42 pm

    Hello Mr. Umar. I am no supporter of violence. If Talibans are found guilty of violence, they should be punished severely. My objection is against blaming everything on Talibans even without a fair trial. Most of the Talibans I have met are simple and pious Muslims. Much better than Musharraf, Zardari and Sharif. They are honest and truthful people who follow the simple teachings of Islam in contrast to our politicians who lead a corrupt and lavish lifestyle.

    Please do not be misled by western and English media propaganda. Compare the frugal and ascetic lifestyle of Talibans with the lavishness of our political leadership and decide for yourself who is on the straight path of Islam.

  70. Absar says:
    August 23rd, 2008 5:52 pm

    Bhai Mustafa
    Who are you defending
    The Taliban have themselves claimed responsibility for these murders
    They are saying they did this and are proud of commuting these murders and you are telling us theyvare Bholey badshahs!
    Yaar bholey badshah you aap go!
    Do you even live in the same Pakistan as us?

  71. Aamir Ali says:
    August 23rd, 2008 6:41 pm

    Mustafa:

    The Taliban are terrorists who sabotage infrastructure, send suicide bombers, explode car bombs, kill civilians, police, and army, burn down girls schools and attack businesses and NGO’s.

    That makes the Taliban evil and un-Islamic. You need to develop the courage to call a terrorist a terrorist.

  72. Hassan Rizvi says:
    August 23rd, 2008 10:06 pm

    For the love of God stop acting like ostriches (or pigeons since there is soooo much emphasis on religion) …. quit blaming Americans and the “Western world” for all our miseries … John Smith and Joe Blow are not blowing themselves up to kill us, ironically it is Mohammed Shafiq and Mustafa Ahmed who have been brain washed by the perverted view of Islam by the Mullahs. It is the ignorance of not questioning anything that is leading people to blindly follow these mullahs and kill themselves and innocent people. ANYONE who says either you follow my religion exactly as I do or else you are liable to die is NOT even a human being let alone a Muslim.

  73. Adnan says:
    August 24th, 2008 12:30 am

    So whats the concrete solution guys?

  74. Wahid says:
    August 24th, 2008 1:55 am

    More killings by these murderers today. This really is war on Pakistan by the Talibans.

  75. D_a_n says:
    August 24th, 2008 3:22 am

    @ Mustafa Kamal & His worthy partners in absurdity… Wasalaam and Ibrahim… for their utter joy in watching Pakistani Muslims being butchered like the heathens they are!

    I dont know just when it was that you divorced yourself from reality but I hope that you at least got financially well compensated to cater for it…
    either that or your just one of the many ‘jahaaz’ that ‘park’ themselves under chauburji in Lahore every night…Lahori’s will get this reference…

    You say the Taliban have not been convicted in any court of law…wow thats a new one…
    but your statement smells like an outright LIE when you have the Taliban claiming THEMSELVES that they have done this with much pride and glee…
    JUST which of their actions reminds us of the Prophet (PBUH) is something Id like to be schooled on…but not from the likes of you…self hating Mullah Pakistani’s who cannot contain their smiles at the utter destruction of innocent lives…please take a good look at the faces of the women in the photo’s in this post…they look like wives and mothers crying with a helplessness that you and I can not even comprehend…yet you find pleasure in their pain….disgusting…

    @Ibrahim…

    just who in the world left you the sole arbitrer of what I as a Muslim must desire…you say that every Muslim should desire Sharia…I am a Muslim..a practicing one and have no desire for THIS kind of Sharia and I am sick of being told by self righteous Muslims like you just what to do with my faith…

    If THIS is the kind of Sharia that you so desire then wallow in it…why in the world did you NOT migrate to pre-2001 afghanistan and subjected yourself and your children to the suffocating embrace of the beards….
    you do not have the courage to follow through on your convictions yet you feel that Pakistani’s should be butchered to suit what you want….sickening…

    I believe that it is time that whenever and wherever we see people…friends and colleagues talking such garbage we should call them out on their lies and deceit and utter contempt for Pakistani lives….As I have made my habit to do so..I have lost friends and am not the most popular man by far but my conciense is clean….
    we need to socially isolate people like Mustafa Kamal/Ibrahim and Wasalaam and other Mullah’s who would see our kids die with glee….
    This is my Holy struggle..with my keystrokes and with my tongue…I urge others to follow suit….it is the LEAST you can do…your deen demands you to stand up to the modern day Khawarji’s..

  76. Raza says:
    August 24th, 2008 5:57 am
  77. Shahid says:
    August 24th, 2008 8:11 am

    I totally agree with D_A_N. I cannot be put in better words then you did bro.

  78. NB says:
    August 24th, 2008 8:53 am

    @D_a_N

    Well said on every front, and I would add my voice to your words, particularly on the following:

    “I believe that it is time that whenever and wherever we see people

  79. Umar says:
    August 24th, 2008 10:29 am

    Dan… you took the words right out of my mouth… and apparently a number of other like minded mouths too : )

    Mustafa…

    I’ll reply back since you replied to me… when did mere asceticism make one a leader? Granted that Pakistani rulers lead lavish lives, but how does that imply that Charlie’s aunt (to take a leaf out of Khalid Hasan’s book) would make a better leader simply because she is an ascetic… it is possible to be an ignorant ascetic murderer isn’t it? Simply because someone is “simple” as you say does not mean the ideology he wants to impose on the rest of us is palatable… does simplicity and frugality warrant the bombings of girls’ schools, the blowing up of barber shops and the so-called revenge killings of innocents? I for one am simply not willing to live in a Pakistan where my daughter won’t be able to go to school, where I won’t be able to shave, where I won’t be allowed to clap at the cricket stadium when a batsman hits a four, where my favorite band can’t perform in public and where the Finance ministry consists of the head mullah dishing out money from a trunk hidden under his bed… (yes, its true… read the book I reference next…)

    In fact, this is one of the troubles with the Taliban… this “simplicity”… I recall now Ahmed Rashid’s book on them… the ideologies of the Muslim Brotherhood and the Jamaat-e-Islami are equally insane, but at least they are fortified by some impressive scholarship from the likes of Maududi or Syed Qutb… these Taliban are completely divorced from that tradition (their alliance with Bin Laden notwithstanding), and their “simplicity”, frugality and asceticism simply adds another very sinister layer to what the Brotherhood or the Jamaat preached…

    As for being brainwashed by propaganda, it is obvious that the West isn’t the only entity with a propaganda machine… Nawa-e-Waqt or any similar Urdu daily, and sundry TV hosts do an excellent job as the propaganda wing of the Taliban…

  80. auk says:
    August 24th, 2008 11:29 am

    From Today’s “The News”.

    These are the same people who claimed responsibility for the Wah blasts and then threatened to attack other cities. Now they are calling for a ceasefire when they are on the receiving end. Did they give the poor souls who were killed a chance of a ceasefire? I would say no ceasefire until Maulvi Omar is either killed or captured. For once I agree with this government.

    Govt rejects Taliban’s unilateral ceasefire

    ISLAMABAD: Advisor to prime minister on interior Rehman Malik has said the operation against Taliban would continue until their surrender.

    Talking to media in Islamabad today, he said the unilateral ceasefire announced by Taliban is not acceptable, as they had broken previous pledges.

    The advisor said the ceasefire can only hold if Taliban surrender their arms publicly in Islamabad.

    Malik said that 550 Taliban have been killed in the Bajaur military operation, while a number of dead bodies were still lying in the area.

    To a question he said that some of killed and arrested militants are Uzbiks, details of whom will be shared with media soon.

    Rehman Malik said that 300,000 people have been displaced in Bajour and eighty thousand in Deer due to military operation.

    The advisor said that 80 million rupees have been earmarked for relief and rehabilitation of the affectees, while 10,000 tents have been set-up in Deer for them.

    To a question he said that one of the suicide bomber caught in Wah, has told investigators that he was told that he is going to ‘kill westerners’ by his mentors.

  81. Adnan says:
    August 24th, 2008 11:40 am

    Everybody…………Listen,

    Why dont we stop fighting for a day on this forum and see if there is a rational solution to this problem???

  82. ShahidnUSA says:
    August 24th, 2008 12:44 pm

    In Talibans defence
    They believe in their beliefs that they are doing the right thing.
    They lust for fight and feed on hate. Word “peace” was never in their dictionary or it has to be under their terms.
    The rest of the world is just “wrong” in their eyes.
    And they are the one, who would “correct” it.
    They totally believe in whatever they believe.
    Like a cult, you can get in but you cant get out.

  83. Harris Siddiqui says:
    August 24th, 2008 1:27 pm

    There is only one solution to this problem in my view. Try your best to make sure that these people loose the ability to recruit new blood in their organization.

    The process will require a multi dimensional approach and will not be an easy solution by any means but then again, solutions to complicated problems are rarely simple.

    1) The government must do anything they can to bring the 22,000 mostly unregulated madrasas into the mainstream. Every existing madrasa must conform to a single standard and must provide their students education that enables them to be a productive part of the society.

    2) The private sector and the people of Pakistan must perform their duties as well. I envision a non-profit organization which provides orphans or poor children the best education possible with boarding to compete with the madrasas. Lets see if these little minds can be moulded to do great things.

    3) There are almost 32,000,000 graduates and current students in the existing madrasas. If you look 15 years in the future and consider the reproduction rate of poor Pakistanis the number will give you nightmares. We must do all we can to develop our impoverish areas and provide these graduates of the madrasas with employement opportunities so the last thing in their minds is to blow themselves up in the name of God.

    4) The most obvious solution is to eradicate the current crop of talibans from the face of the earth. I plead to my nation for patience and determination. My heart goes out to the poor civilians who have and will be the innocent victims but this cancer has to be removed through surgery and every surgery results in some blood loss.

    Lets play our part as best as we can. If we remain quiet, we will be the ones to blame when our country disintegrates.

    Harris Siddiqui

  84. Mustafa Kamal says:
    August 24th, 2008 5:39 pm

    It is clear from the discussion on this forum that English speaking intelligentsia is singularly incapable of understanding the aspirations of common Pakistani. They are dazzled by the materialistic culture of the West and want to emulate western systems here in Pakistan. However Pakistani awaam is now woken up. Common Pakistani understands that the systems preferred by English speaking intelligentsia are for their personal benefit alone. They have disinherited common Pakistani from social, economic and political life of Pakistan. The only solution in this dark hour is return to our Islamic roots. We already have the best possible social, economic and political systems clearly detailed in Islam. All we need to do is to adopt this system whole heartedly and not mess them up with half baked western ideas. Common Pakistani is fed up with the pretensions of their elites and his heart aches for the simplicity and straightforwardness that cannot be provided by current systems.

    This is my last post on this forum because clearly this forum is infested with anti-spiritul and anti-Islamic forces who are brainwashed by western and Indian media. Anyway, English language bloggers have zero influence on the mind of common Pakistani and hence their sinister designs are bound to fail. It is better to utilize one’s precious time on field work rather than “bhains ke aage been bajaaye”.

    Good luck with your blogging!

  85. Shan says:
    August 24th, 2008 6:34 pm

    Muslims are the laughing stock- as well as the most despised community- of the world, and yet we refuse to be critical of the direction are societies are taking. there is a persecution-complex that comes out of the insecurity of being left behind culturally and technologically.

    look what the u.s has done to latin america, much worse than anything to a muslim country, do they strap themselves up and murder innocents?

    look at whats happening in kashmir right now. a mass of people marching peacefully has brought so much international attention to the problem. much more than wanton suicide bombs or an insurgency. our kashmir/india/ taliban policy has been a colossal failiure and will continue to be so until our milatiristic mentality changes.

    i think the islam that these taliban preach is a murderous, mysoginistic death cult. it needs to be rejected or we are all doomed.

  86. Riaz says:
    August 24th, 2008 7:44 pm

    Eduction is the only solution for this murderous cycle we are caught in. As long as we are lead by the Zardaries, Shariefs, and Musharrafs of the world, this will mayhem will remain our destiny. Instead of educating the poor, these selfish bastards are either lining their pockets with billions of dollars or feeding their egos. And I strongly believe that either they are directly involved in these atrocities, or benefiting them one way or an other. Does any one honestly believe that the good of the poor is their motivation?

  87. Raza says:
    August 24th, 2008 8:14 pm

    More Blasts!

    ATTOCK: Four people were injured after three blasts happened in a CD Plaza early morning in District Attack of Punjab here on Sunday.

    http://www.geo.tv/8-24-2008/23386.htm

  88. Zar Khan says:
    August 24th, 2008 8:19 pm

    It is very complicated and one single thing can not solve the Taliban issue. What we can do is to turn the public of Pakistan against the Taliban. I think media (TV channels, newspapers, radio, etc.) can play very important role here. Invite real scholars of Islam and have them speak against the suicide bombings on TV, radio and in the mosques. Show the innocent families who lost the loved ones on TV. Turn the people of Pakistan against extremism.
    Secondly, we have to see the reasons for this extremism. It is the government’s job to provide people more economic opportunities, jobs, better education to people of Pakistan in general and NWFP in particular. There may be some upper class and rich people fighting (or killing) in the name of Islam but the foot soldiers (suicide bombers) are always the poor people. And please stop blaming everything on America and take the blame for our own actions.

  89. Rasheed says:
    August 25th, 2008 12:12 am

    I agree it’s complicated. But demonization of the enemy and killing or Guantanamizing him does not solve the problem. President Manuel Antonio Noriega was kidnapped from his country twenty years ago by powerful foreign forces and carried to another country, which acted as prosecutor, judge and jury, and locked him up for good. The allegations were drugs. Name me one high school in America today where a lot of kids don’t do drugs. So tell me what solution you’re asking for here — are you just looking to get high by burning the Taliban’s beards, blowing up their bases, and watching the rubble bounce, or do you want to end the pain and crying of the mothers and sisters in the images. The so-called war on terror is being fought, IMHO, like the lost war on drugs. I despise the stupid Taliban and dirty Mullah’s, but also believe that if ever they’re brought to trial, as some of you are dreaming on this blog, their trial would be similar to the ones for Gen. Noriega and those held in Guantanamo. Let’s face it: The Taliban may be plenty evil, but they sure do NOT enjoy monopoly over evil. Since their evil was NOT nipped in its bud, rather was cultivated and nourished by bigger evil forces, don’t expect it to go away any time soon! :(

  90. Haroon says:
    August 25th, 2008 1:46 am

    Dear Mr. Mustafa Kamal, from your message I guess you are referring to yourself when you say “English speaking intelligentsia”.

    Can you also please verify who has appointed you the spokesman for the “common Pakistani”?

    Also, you say “here in Pakistan”, can you please tell us where in Pakistan you are writing. Remember, Allah knows the truth in our hearts!

  91. SABIR says:
    August 25th, 2008 2:17 am

    Mustafa Kamal. What are you saying that you are the only one who speaks for “common Pakistanis”.

    Any opnion you do not like must be “materialistic”? Why? How is calling murderers murderers “materialistic”? Please do explain.

  92. D_a_n says:
    August 25th, 2008 5:46 am

    @Umar, NB & Shahid…

    Thanks for the echoing my thoughts…I find myself extremely troubled that as a fully practicing Muslim I find myself mostly isolated when I speak up….

    unfortunately I do not see this consensus developing anytime soon….I now understand how a nation of hundreds of Millions was subjugated by a couple hundred thousand English…we did not show enough spine then…and this struggle too exposes our utter bankruptcy…we see other’s children die and shrug and move on…finding excuses to justify the behavior of ‘fellow Muslims’ evil deeds…not realizing that our own kin will not be spared by a Mullah thinking rationally that we too Pray..pay Zakat and fast in the name of the most Merciful and the one true creator…

    one thing that I do not understand is the argument of fighting ‘our own people’…this argument is utterly nullified by the actions of Hazrat-e-Ali (RA) who waged a full fledged war on the Khawarji’s and did out to death approx 40,000 of them….

    Now we have a choice…we can stand with Ali (RA) or we can stand with the Khawarji’s…I for one will stand with Ali (RA)

    I sadly see that the majority of Pakistani’s have somehow ‘stockholm syndrom-ed’ themselves into siding with the Khawarji’s…

    so what if they are our own people…if you see your own brother try to set fire to your own house…if you see your own brother try to deny your child polio medication and if you see your own brother deny your daughter an education..what will you do…I’ll tell you what I’ll do…I will shed blood if I have to to keep my family and house safe from my own brother…
    what will you do if you see your own brother try to kill your parents…? I believe the answer is obvious…

    Being a fellow Muslim DOES NOT give you the right to subjugate me and my children…it DOES NOT give you a blank cheque to take over my house and impose yourself on how I raise my children..
    it DOES NOT give you the right to decide if I live or die…

    which is indeed the main problem with the Mullah…he has basically tried to outsource all the functions of Allah SWT…as in who is a man of faith..who will live…who will die…who will go to heaven etc…
    and THAT my friends is Blasphemy…our own Prophet (PBUH)…the epic of humanity…He himself never claimed that he was guaranteed paradise and begged for Allah’s favour…can you imagine the Humanity…the utter loss of self in front of Allah that he showed us all…
    Yet..Pakistani’s are putting their own faith in men…mere men who claim to be doling out one way tickets to paradise and one way tickets to hell…
    now THAT is blasphemy and our disregard for this most profound yet simple concept is the cause of our own butchery at the hands of the beards…

    @ Mustafa Kamal and Ilk…

    just because I write here in english is no need for you to rejoice that my words will ring hollow and change anybody’s mind…you should temper your joy at knowing that the people killed in Wah were not what you would call ‘English Speaking Intelligentsia’….yet i write for them…and the women in the photographs…whose grief you find so utterly amusing…I write for the poor children who have just had their fathers stolen from them for no fault of their own…the children…Who I pray will curse you and your kind for eternity…for I am a Gunah Gar Momin…I do not know how effective my communication will Allah is..but I do know that the orphaned child (in whose orphanage you delight)…if he prays for justice….Allah will Listen…and I pray that you find yourself on the receiving end of that Justice…
    for if my Lord is silent now…HE will not stay silent forever…and that should..more that anything I can say…make you change your mind…
    I am done with you here…

  93. Arif Beg says:
    August 25th, 2008 12:43 pm

    Make no mistake folks – we are going through a civil war.

    There are two competing visions of Pakistan that are tearing this country apart. First is inspired by Qaid-E-Azam; a vision of modern and progressive Pakistan where your faith is your private business. It has nothing to do with state. It is something between you and your God. The second is inspired by clerics of Iran and Saudi Arab, where your faith or lack of it is the business of state. It is state’s responsibility to judge your moral progress and give reward/ punishment to improve your moral progress.

    Pakistan started with the first but very soon started veering toward the other. In this the responsibility of liberal elements of society should not be underestimated. With each such move, we kept silent hoping that things will finally take right course on their own. Alas! You do not get different result unless you act differently.

    We have to understand that it is impossible to argue with divinely guided people. They can only be defeated. Military victory is necessary but that is only a part of it. Not even the most important part. In my view, the most important battle is to be fought in the hearts and minds of common Pakistani. And it is this field where we have been lacking. All of us need to fight this battle. In our homes, in our streets, in our offices, in our schools, in letters to editors, blogs, emails, websites everywhere. It is not an ordinary battle. It is the very question of Pakistan’s survival.

  94. whatever says:
    August 25th, 2008 10:08 pm

    Stop blaming others for your problems.

  95. Parveen says:
    August 25th, 2008 10:57 pm

    This is challenge number 1 for Pakistan today and for the future

  96. Naseem says:
    August 26th, 2008 9:36 am

    The Taliban are not only operating on the NWF border. Now we are seeing peoples from that area migrating to cities like Karachi which they think are safer, but only marginally so.

    And guess what, the taliban is following the migration , they are moving into cities like Karachi too.

    Soon the taliban will have followers of their “true” Islam in Karachi, Islamabad, Lahore etc.

    The barber and music shops here will close too, clean shaved individuals will be start to keep their beards, and the girls must learn to live at home.

    The response for the government will be as it always is; further local deals with them, but in the end for the sake of peace, all of Pakistan will have shariat; nothing wrong with this ofcourse, if it was good enough for the rasool (pbuh) it will be good enough for us; still I suspect that there will be a lot more crying before we reach this wonderful utopia.

  97. Masood Ahmad says:
    August 26th, 2008 10:53 am

    “all of Pakistan will have shariat; nothing wrong with this ofcourse, if it was good enough for the rasool (pbuh) it will be good enough for us; ”

    As a secular Muslim, I object to this.

    Please keep your sharia, your bible, your veda for those who willingly accept them. We atheists have as much right to live in Pakistan as anyone else.

  98. Usman Kadiri says:
    August 26th, 2008 12:20 pm

    @Masood:

    “As a secular Muslim, I object to this.”

    There is no such thing like “secular Muslim”. Being a Muslim by definition means having unshakeable faith in Allah(SWT) and His Prophet (PBUH).

    “Please keep your sharia, your bible, your veda for those who willingly accept them. We atheists have as much right to live in Pakistan as anyone else.”

    Your words are clearly blasphemous.

    Please note that Pakistan was created in the name of Islam. Atheists may live in this country but they cannot demand equal rights.

  99. Raza says:
    August 26th, 2008 2:09 pm

    “Please note that Pakistan was created in the name of Islam.”

    Really? Then why were Mullahs so opposed to Pakistan’s creation?

    Few examples;

    Maududi: Napakistan
    Fazlu’s father Mufti Mehmood: Gunnah (sin)

  100. Mohd Hafeez says:
    August 26th, 2008 2:47 pm

    Usman, please check up teh meaning of “secular”. MOST Muslims in the world and through history are secular. Meaning that they take Islam VERY SERIOUSLY as a personal matter but not as a political tool. Certainly all of the Mughals were secular as were most of the Ummaiyad dynasty. In fact, at teh height of its power in Andulusia the Muslim government was entirely secular. It has NOTHING to do with the strength of one’s faith. It has to do with how much of one’s personal faith is allowed to interfere in otehr people’s lives. That’s all.

    There is a certain silliness in teh Pakistani mullah mentality that lies about teh meaning of “secularism” (also of “liberalism”) to say that it means lack of faith or no faith, etc. I am secular and I am a VERY GOOD PRACTICING MUSLIM. You or anyone else has no right to tell me whether I am or am not a good Muslim. We will let Allah decide that on the Day of Judgement, and I am confident that I will be triumphant then and those advocating the killing of innocent people in the name of God and Prophet will rot in Hell.

  101. Mazhar says:
    August 26th, 2008 2:49 pm

    “Please note that Pakistan was created in the name of Islam. Atheists may live in this country but they cannot demand equal rights.”

    Guys this is the most brutally honest upright statement ever made in Pakistaniat. I just want to make it even more correct and substitute Athiests for Non-Muslims or Kafirs.

    This statement is the very difference between us and the West. This statement is the very reason why we are where we are and the West is where it is. This statement directly identifies with the core fundamentals of Taliban and it directly interferes with the most sacrosanct gift of God to mankind: “freedom of conscience, belief and thought”.

  102. Usman Kadiri says:
    August 26th, 2008 4:36 pm

    “This statement is the very difference between us and the West. This statement is the very reason why we are where we are and the West is where it is.”

    We don’t want to become like west.

    US has world’s highest crime rates, drug abuse, child abuse, teen pregnancy, racism. Why should we aspire to become like them?

    We have our own values that we need to nurture. It is good that we are not like the west.

  103. Mazhar says:
    August 26th, 2008 6:07 pm

    “Why should we aspire to become like them?”

    I can give you at least one reason. 99942 Apophis. In case you don’t know there is a very slight possibility that this asteroid may hit earth on April 13 2036. Though the collision probability is small, a collision will mean annihilation. The possibility though minuscule, is quite large as compared to any other threat the planet has faced in the last 50,000 years.

    While you are busy here debating Shariat law in Pakistan, the moral-less drug-abusing scientists at Stanford and MIT in conjunction with NASA are drawing plans worth billions of dollars to face this eventuality. In case you are inclined, it will make a fascinating read so as to what all humanity has to offer scientifically in order to save this planet and what are the pros and cons of each alternative on the future of Earth. It is also worth mentioning that NASA recruits people on merit and not on whether they are believers or kafirs.

    You don’t need to worry about all these trivial matters, you will automatically get saved by the high-crime-rate west society if they save this planet. Unfortunately with you your Talibani “values” will also be saved, that contribute nothing to humanity except intolerance.

  104. Ibrahim says:
    August 26th, 2008 9:51 pm

    Thank you people, espeically Masood Ahmad and Mohd Hafeez, for comic relief. Wow, just wow! The ignorance and arrogance of such people, may Allah help us!

    A “secular Muslim”?!! That’s like saying a “Christian Buddhist” or a “Jewish Hindu”. Then, Masood Ahmad calls himself “atheists…”. So, who is he? A Muslim or a secularist/atheists? A person who thinks he is secular, knowing the meaning of what secularism, is outside the fold of Islam.

    Mohd Hafeez, who sounds more like D_a_n, thinks staying away from politics means secularism. He doesn’t even know what secularism is and he calls for it. Secularism in its simplest form means separation of religion (church) and state…to rule by other than Allah’s laws (which would includes hadd punishments as well). And, that my friend, is straight up kufr. It doesn’t matter if you believe it or not. To be a leader and deliberately not implement shariah (the laws of Allah) and replace them by man-made laws, then that leader is a Muslim no more. This is a very simple concept in Islamic creed, but you would only know it if you had taken the time to learn some Islam.

    Similarly, a non-leader (from the awaam/common people) who is against the implementation of shariah amongst Muslims leaves the fold of Islam for the same reason.

    Then, Mohd Hafeez tells another joke that majority of Muslims in history have been secularists. If he still thinks that after knowing the correct definition (separation of religion and state/ruling by other than Allah’s laws), then he is delusional and cannot be reasoned with. Btw, Mohd Hafeez’s jokes don’t end here. The last paragraph of his comment is nothing but a complete joke…”I am a very good practicing Muslim”. I have never heard such arrogance.

    Allah’s book and His laws weren’t just a lip service. They were sent down to be implemented and followed.

  105. D_a_n says:
    August 27th, 2008 3:17 am

    @ usman kadri..

    Before you are ‘allowed’ to pronounce which type of Pakistani’s should have any rights or not…

    you really do need to address the very inconvenient question put to you raza..ie..if Pakistan was such a good Islamic Idea…then why were the dirty Mullah’s so against it…chiefly Maudoodi and his Ilk…

    it was either:

    1. They were bought off by the Birtish and/or Congress…
    2. Pakistan was such a good Islamic Idea…
    3. They just got it wrong like they have gotten wrong everyother thing…

    neither of the scenario’s looks good for you side im afraid…

    and wasnt it Jinnah Saab Who said that we are free to go to our temples…mosques…churches and that has nothing to do with the business of the state?
    care to explain that for me?

  106. Usman Kadiri says:
    August 27th, 2008 11:51 am

    @Mazhar:

    What makes you think that I support Talibani values?

    I am against all violence whether it is committed by Talibans or Americans. However I do believe in “innocent until proven guilty” maxim.

    BTW, I do not understand what you want to prove by referring to Stanford and MIT educated NASA engineers. Go parse their statistics and you will find that more than 50% of them are Chinese, Indians and Pakistanis.

  107. D_a_n says:
    August 27th, 2008 4:40 pm

    @ Ibrahim…

    you smugly pronounced that many of us stand ‘ex-communicated’ as it were from Islam…but last time i checked Allah SWT had not given this power to any living man or woman..it’s funny how the Mullah has always pined and begged to be given a role which is a copy of the christian clergy….again…the Mullah trying to outsource ..what lies in Allah SWT’s domain..

    You DO NOT have the right to declare anyone outside the fold of MY deen…please try to reconcile to that fact

    secondly…you keep going on and on about shariat…
    yet you never ONCE mention WHICH shariat do you want to see implemented…is it the demented one proposed by the evil Khwaraji Taliban …or is it the heartless tribal and politically expedient one of the sad Kingdom of Saudi Arabia…
    and what If of all those who would advocate a different form of shariat than you? what of them Ibrahim? would you declare them excommunicated from Islam too? or would you just do what the Taliban khwaraji’s do…ie, execute them like the Taliban Khawarji’s execute shia POWs?

    your intolerance is repugnant…

    i feel like hanging my head in shame thinking that I spent years risking my life …so that people such as yourself could sleep safely in bed..

  108. Mazhar says:
    August 27th, 2008 5:26 pm

    ” Go parse their statistics and you will find that more than 50% of them are Chinese, Indians and Pakistanis.”

    That’s exactly what my point was that you missed completely, that the selection there is based on merit, and not on whether they are Christians or Non-Christians. That is the reason NASA is the best mankind has to offer.

    Your ideology that only muslims should hold exclusivity in the society is an inferior one and I just gave you one example of it.

  109. MUSLIM says:
    August 28th, 2008 12:07 am

    The comments here show exactly why we are in this problem. People are at it here too. Fighting over whose interpretation of religion is right and whose is wrong. D_a_n or Usman, please leave us alone, both of you fanatics. Just let us be and whatever your views on religion , practice them yourself and leave us alone. Please. It is arguments exactly like your that end up in self-righteous killing.

  110. Ghazala says:
    August 28th, 2008 1:44 am

    Thank you Adil Najam for this moving post. But it is really lost on most of your readers who seem to enjoy fighting over faith. This violence is not going to stop easily.

  111. Masood Ahmad says:
    August 28th, 2008 1:53 pm

    @Ibrahim:

    What is so hard to understand about “secular Muslim”?

    I am born in a Muslim family. I love my Islamic heritage. I find myself most at home with Islamic culture. In fact I find it one of the most beautiful cultures.

    Yet I do not accept theological tenets of Islam about God and Prophet as valid. I have no issues with anyone practicing Islam, however, it is not for me. I consider all religions as man made.

    Which of the above you do not understand? Who gave you authority to decide if I have an equal right or not to live in Pakistan? Please read your scriptures and your constitution. Both are explicit on this issue. Neither of them limit my rights to live in this country with dignity and self respect in line with my secular and atheist beliefs.

  112. ShahidnUSA says:
    August 28th, 2008 6:01 pm

    Secularism in pakistan is as inevitable as the sun would rise from the east tomorrow.

    Remember you heard it here first.

  113. Usman Kadiri says:
    August 29th, 2008 1:24 pm

    @Masood

    “I am born in a Muslim family. I love my Islamic heritage. I find myself most at home with Islamic culture. In fact I find it one of the most beautiful cultures.

    Yet I do not accept theological tenets of Islam about God and Prophet as valid.”

    Being born in a Muslim family or liking Islamic heritage have nothing to do with being a Muslim. Your views on God and prophet (PBUH) place you firmly outside the fold of Muslims.

    “Please read your scriptures and your constitution. Both are explicit on this issue. Neither of them limit my rights to live in this country with dignity and self respect in line with my secular and atheist beliefs.”

    This shows nothing but your ignorance. Blasphemy is a criminal offense as per both – Islamic scripture and Pakistani constitution.

  114. A. Jadoon says:
    August 30th, 2008 10:20 am

    The comments her are funny and sad. Can everyone please keep their religious beliefs to themselves. Why advertise your convuluted beliefs to the world. Isn’t this disturbing focus on religion what got us into this mess. And, everyone, can you please STOP playing God. becoming a good Muslim yourself and people will follow you. Going around with a disturbed set of beliefs and telling people who is or is not a Muslim and threatening them with death is what Talibans do. Please spare us that!

  115. Waseem says:
    September 1st, 2008 10:08 am

    The defense of death in the name of religion is the death of religion!

    May Allah grant us the wisdom to live in peace rather than die in the name of false beliefs!

  116. Syed Asim Hussain says:
    September 7th, 2008 9:35 am

    Dear Adil Najam. This is my first visit to your site today. I came here from the link on Adnan Siddiqi’s blog expecting something different. But I am amazed and moved by the sincerity and power of writing here from you and also from many of the commenters. I have read a number of posts here and all the comments and while the subjects are very sad they give me hope that we still have people with a sensitive heart who are willing to stand up and speak out for that which is right and true. Keep it up please.

  117. Umar Shah says:
    September 7th, 2008 1:16 pm

    This is the legacy of Zia -supporter of the Afghan mujahideen and a foreign war, Benazir -mother of the Talibaan, her interior minister who recruited Mullah Omar, Nawaz Sharif -fundamentalist pleaser and Musharraf -coerced partner in the ‘war on terror’. Each of these despots let foreigners roam around freely in the country, establish themselves and sow the seeds of hatred against genuine freedom, progress, right of free speech & anything good or worthwhile and the price was and is paid by Pakistanis every single time. If we dont want to become another Yugoslavia we have to force these Arabs, Uzbeks, Chechens, Afghans and misc other non-Pakistanis out of Pakistan to prevent them from poisoning the hearts and minds of our people into committing such acts.

  118. Qureshi says:
    September 7th, 2008 6:46 pm

    I do not like Zardari much, but I think you need a politician to solve this violence and mess. If he can do that and stop these murders by the Taliban then he will have my support.

  119. Zaid Hamid says:
    September 8th, 2008 12:52 am

    Please see and circulate this video!

    This video of the latest edition of BrassTacks needs to be circulated to every Pakistani in the world! Do your duty and spread the word and expose the enemy game plan. The sinister game exposed is half the battle won for Pakistanis and Muslims.

    http://www.brasstacks.pk/videos.aspx?ep=41

    Zaid Hamid

  120. Tim Birdsong says:
    September 16th, 2010 9:13 am

    This is a Video Diary of me crying tears everyday for 40-days for the suffering people of Pakistan
    http://www.4shared.com/dir/bMQwR8vk/Tears_for_Humanity-Pakistan.html
    (Link back in to see video updates. I will make one video a day for 40 days, from Aug.

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